Comments on: Gnoetry: interview with Eric Elshtain http://writerresponsetheory.org/wordpress/2006/04/02/gnoetry-interview-with-eric-elshtain/ a blog and podcast dedicated to discussing text arts forms Mon, 06 Oct 2008 17:46:47 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.0.2 en Writer Response Theory 2004-2005 wrt@writerresponsetheory.org (Writer Response Theory) wrt@writerresponsetheory.org Talk Radio Comment-cast: Gnoetry: interview with Eric Elshtain Comment-cast: Gnoetry: interview with Eric Elshtain Writer Response Theory Writer Response Theory wrt@writerresponsetheory.org http://writerresponsetheory.org/wordpress/wp-content/uploads/iTWRT.JPG WRT: Writer Response Theory http://writerresponsetheory.org/wordpress 144 144 by: Red Rover Experiment #9, Gnoetry at Impossible to work http://writerresponsetheory.org/wordpress/2006/04/02/gnoetry-interview-with-eric-elshtain/#comment-16476 Mon, 23 Oct 2006 05:51:23 +0000 http://writerresponsetheory.org/wordpress/2006/04/02/gnoetry-interview-with-eric-elshtain/#comment-16476 [...] When you go to a performance and all of the seats are lined up on one side of the room facing the other side of the room, it becomes pretty clear that one side of the space is for the audience and the other is the stage for the performers. When you are invited to perform as part of a larger reading series, the organizers of the series are going to want to say something at the start and/or finish of your performance (it’s their show, no matter who the star of the current installment is). They are, after all, the ones who acquired the space, sent out press releases, and made the whole event possible in the first place. At the end of the Gnoetry performance, Jen Karmin and Amina Cain (the curators of the series) got up to talk. While they read a pair of poems defining the words Red and Rover, the whole gaggle of Gnoetry folks tittered away behind them on stage. This is beyond rude. This was ridiculously disrespectful to the women who made this reading possible in the first place. But I wasn’t surprised by it at all, they just didn’t seem like serious poets. I think I learn more about performance from bad performances than from good ones. Regardless, I was shocked to dislike it so much. When it comes to experimental work, I think it’s ok to not be good as long as it’s interesting. Previous experiments have involved artists I respect. The series itself is curated by two women I respect. This was a fluke, as far as I’m concerned. The work sounded interesting in theory, but if there’s one thing I learned while a college student, it’s that theory can be less than useless in practice. Any rigid theory will quickly collapse while more fluid theories take longer to break down. ↩In an interview, Elshtain explained that the word gnoetry is itself a recursive acronym, though no one remembers what it stands for. Lack of documentation can really kill a mood. ↩This all works as a part of a semi-automated process. The user selects one or more texts to be used by the software. Then s/he makes a choice regarding what percentage of these texts will be used. The next step is to select a poetic form (Haiku, Tanka, Blank Verse, etc.). The software does some stastical analysis and creates a poem. The user then decides which words will and will not be included in the final poem. Those words that don’t make the cut are then removed by the software and replaced with other words that “work” according to the software’s textual analysis. ↩The way I see it, if this is to be a true collaboration between a human and a piece of software, then the humans must be bound by constraints in much the same way that the software is ↩Ezra Pound had a profound influence on the ultimate shape and content of “The Waste Land” but it’s not Pound’s poem at all, it’s T. S. Eliot’s. In much the same way, these poems are Gnoetry’s works, edited by humans ↩Eric Elshtain, who is a graduate student at my alma mater appears to be the theoretical force behind this project ↩we should really call them authors or editors, because they do the same work as one. I see little difference between what they’re doing and what Burroughs, Gysin, or any number of other writers before them did, save the use of a computer ↩It felt like they didn’t really discuss these things before hand. Perhaps the anti-capitalist understood that they had to all be dressed as workers and he didn’t think office workers at all but the people in charge hadn’t even thought of such a conclusion being drawn by a member of the group. ↩It’s pretty obvious without the game of musical chairs ↩ [...] […] When you go to a performance and all of the seats are lined up on one side of the room facing the other side of the room, it becomes pretty clear that one side of the space is for the audience and the other is the stage for the performers. When you are invited to perform as part of a larger reading series, the organizers of the series are going to want to say something at the start and/or finish of your performance (it’s their show, no matter who the star of the current installment is). They are, after all, the ones who acquired the space, sent out press releases, and made the whole event possible in the first place. At the end of the Gnoetry performance, Jen Karmin and Amina Cain (the curators of the series) got up to talk. While they read a pair of poems defining the words Red and Rover, the whole gaggle of Gnoetry folks tittered away behind them on stage. This is beyond rude. This was ridiculously disrespectful to the women who made this reading possible in the first place. But I wasn’t surprised by it at all, they just didn’t seem like serious poets. I think I learn more about performance from bad performances than from good ones. Regardless, I was shocked to dislike it so much. When it comes to experimental work, I think it’s ok to not be good as long as it’s interesting. Previous experiments have involved artists I respect. The series itself is curated by two women I respect. This was a fluke, as far as I’m concerned. The work sounded interesting in theory, but if there’s one thing I learned while a college student, it’s that theory can be less than useless in practice. Any rigid theory will quickly collapse while more fluid theories take longer to break down. ↩In an interview, Elshtain explained that the word gnoetry is itself a recursive acronym, though no one remembers what it stands for. Lack of documentation can really kill a mood. ↩This all works as a part of a semi-automated process. The user selects one or more texts to be used by the software. Then s/he makes a choice regarding what percentage of these texts will be used. The next step is to select a poetic form (Haiku, Tanka, Blank Verse, etc.). The software does some stastical analysis and creates a poem. The user then decides which words will and will not be included in the final poem. Those words that don’t make the cut are then removed by the software and replaced with other words that “work” according to the software’s textual analysis. ↩The way I see it, if this is to be a true collaboration between a human and a piece of software, then the humans must be bound by constraints in much the same way that the software is ↩Ezra Pound had a profound influence on the ultimate shape and content of “The Waste Land” but it’s not Pound’s poem at all, it’s T. S. Eliot’s. In much the same way, these poems are Gnoetry’s works, edited by humans ↩Eric Elshtain, who is a graduate student at my alma mater appears to be the theoretical force behind this project ↩we should really call them authors or editors, because they do the same work as one. I see little difference between what they’re doing and what Burroughs, Gysin, or any number of other writers before them did, save the use of a computer ↩It felt like they didn’t really discuss these things before hand. Perhaps the anti-capitalist understood that they had to all be dressed as workers and he didn’t think office workers at all but the people in charge hadn’t even thought of such a conclusion being drawn by a member of the group. ↩It’s pretty obvious without the game of musical chairs ↩ […]

]]> Red Rover Experiment #9, Gnoetry at Impossible to work [...] When you go to a performance and all of the seats are lined up on one side of the ... [...] When you go to a performance and all of the seats are lined up on one side of the ... by: We Revise Together: Blogging on Writer Response Theory at WRT: Writer Response Theory http://writerresponsetheory.org/wordpress/2006/04/02/gnoetry-interview-with-eric-elshtain/#comment-16229 Thu, 19 Oct 2006 01:29:05 +0000 http://writerresponsetheory.org/wordpress/2006/04/02/gnoetry-interview-with-eric-elshtain/#comment-16229 [...] Eric Elshtain [...] […] Eric Elshtain […]

]]> We Revise Together: Blogging on Writer Response Theory at WRT: Writer Response Theory [...] Eric Elshtain [...] [...] Eric Elshtain [...] by: WRT: Writer Response Theory » Blog Archive » WRT interview with Chris Crawford http://writerresponsetheory.org/wordpress/2006/04/02/gnoetry-interview-with-eric-elshtain/#comment-6515 Mon, 24 Apr 2006 23:03:59 +0000 http://writerresponsetheory.org/wordpress/2006/04/02/gnoetry-interview-with-eric-elshtain/#comment-6515 [...] Previous WRT (text) interviews: Gnoetry: Interview with Eric Elshtain; Gimcrack’d: Interview with Chris Klimas; Lightwriting: Interview with Ken Wronkiewics; Ink: Interview with Kym Buchanan. [...] […] Previous WRT (text) interviews: Gnoetry: Interview with Eric Elshtain; Gimcrack’d: Interview with Chris Klimas; Lightwriting: Interview with Ken Wronkiewics; Ink: Interview with Kym Buchanan. […]

]]> WRT: Writer Response Theory » Blog Archive » WRT interview with Chris Crawford [...] Previous WRT (text) interviews: Gnoetry: Interview with Eric Elshtain; Gimcrack’d: Interview with Chris Klimas; Lightwriting: Interview with Ken Wronkiewics; ... [...] Previous WRT (text) interviews: Gnoetry: Interview with Eric Elshtain; Gimcrack’d: Interview with Chris Klimas; Lightwriting: Interview with Ken Wronkiewics; ... by: WRT: Writer Response Theory » Blog Archive » WRT interview with Chris Crawford http://writerresponsetheory.org/wordpress/2006/04/02/gnoetry-interview-with-eric-elshtain/#comment-6510 Mon, 24 Apr 2006 22:59:39 +0000 http://writerresponsetheory.org/wordpress/2006/04/02/gnoetry-interview-with-eric-elshtain/#comment-6510 [...] * Previous WRT (text) interviews: Gnoetry: Interview with Eric Elshtain; Gimcrack’d: Interview with Chris Klimas; Lightwriting: Interview with Ken Wronkiewics; Ink: Interview with Kym Buchanan. [...] […] * Previous WRT (text) interviews: Gnoetry: Interview with Eric Elshtain; Gimcrack’d: Interview with Chris Klimas; Lightwriting: Interview with Ken Wronkiewics; Ink: Interview with Kym Buchanan. […]

]]> WRT: Writer Response Theory » Blog Archive » WRT interview with Chris Crawford [...] * Previous WRT (text) interviews: Gnoetry: Interview with Eric Elshtain; Gimcrack’d: Interview with Chris Klimas; Lightwriting: Interview with Ken ... [...] * Previous WRT (text) interviews: Gnoetry: Interview with Eric Elshtain; Gimcrack’d: Interview with Chris Klimas; Lightwriting: Interview with Ken ... by: Jon Trowbridge http://writerresponsetheory.org/wordpress/2006/04/02/gnoetry-interview-with-eric-elshtain/#comment-5671 Wed, 05 Apr 2006 13:30:04 +0000 http://writerresponsetheory.org/wordpress/2006/04/02/gnoetry-interview-with-eric-elshtain/#comment-5671 Jeremy: I never found the time to package up the Gnoetry 0.2 source code for release, but the subversion repository that it lives in is publicly available from svn://svn.trowbridge.org/gnoetry Getting it running will probably take a little work. Gnoetry 0.3, which is still under development, is not available. In theory I would like to eventually release it under the GPL, but that probably won't be possible since parts are going to be built on top of proprietary technologies from my current employer. Maybe I'll be able to release a subset of the code, but we'll have to see how things work out. And if there are any poets who know how to program out there, I would welcome external contributions to the Gnoetry source code. Anyone interested in tinkering with Gnoetry should contact me. Jeremy:

I never found the time to package up the Gnoetry 0.2 source code for release, but the subversion repository that it lives in is publicly available from svn://svn.trowbridge.org/gnoetry
Getting it running will probably take a little work.

Gnoetry 0.3, which is still under development, is not available. In theory I would like to eventually release it under the GPL, but that probably won’t be possible since parts are going to be built on top of proprietary technologies from my current employer. Maybe I’ll be able to release a subset of the code, but we’ll have to see how things work out.

And if there are any poets who know how to program out there, I would welcome external contributions to the Gnoetry source code. Anyone interested in tinkering with Gnoetry should contact me.

]]> Jon Trowbridge Jeremy: I never found the time to package up the Gnoetry 0.2 source code for release, but the subversion repository that ... Jeremy: I never found the time to package up the Gnoetry 0.2 source code for release, but the subversion repository that ...